Per Diem Questions

[CFL]

Headrat

I agree with you about dues, like I read on the site you never know who is lurking around, being in the situation that I am in I can say that J.A. Jones in Tbilisi is taxing per diem and the reason giving is that if you signed a contract with the INTENT to stay a year your per diem is taxable by IRS laws(and Fluor). So some people who are warehoused in jobs until they are needed ( like in Tbilisi to tashkent and armenia) we are ok, but everyone else is getting taxed!!! And with people not posting! You have nothing to lose, most companies are out the for themselves not the workers!! People we need to hear from all of you!! :wtf

[dan4th]

Does anyone know where I can find tax laws on whether Per Diem is taxable or not. It is my understanding that Per Diem is non taxable as long as you work on a job for less than one year, after that you can be taxed for the full year of Per Diem. I am not 100% sure of this and if companies are taxing Per Diem then we are loosing part of the incentive for doing this kind of work. So far I have heard of two companies on two jobs taxing or wanting to tax Per Diem. We need to have proof of the law if we are going to put a stop to this kind of action. Any help pointing me in the right direction to look in I will search to try and find an answer.

[TheJester]

Ok, simply, here is something you ALWAYS need to remember about Per Diem:

PER DIEM CAN NOT BE TAXED FOR ANY REASON AT ANY TIME

[HeadRat]

Amount is ok. Have you set up a payment means yet? Hopefully electronic, PayPal or someyhing like it?[/QUOTE=Sparky58]
Yes, it will be electronic payments thru PayPal, IE: Credit Cards and Electronic Check.
[QUOTE=pattersonpsd]Headrat
I agree with you about dues, like I read on the site you never know who is lurking around, being in the situation that I am in I can say that J.A. Jones in Tbilisi is taxing per diem and the reason giving is that if you signed a contract with the INTENT to stay a year your per diem is taxable by IRS laws(and Fluor). So some people who are warehoused in jobs until they are needed ( like in Tbilisi to tashkent and armenia) we are ok, but everyone else is getting taxed!!! And with people not posting! You have nothing to lose, most companies are out the for themselves not the workers!! People we need to hear from all of you!! :wtf
If you're Per Diem is getting taxed, you need to get in contact with a Lawyer because you are taking it in the butt.
I know for a fact that Natch, member on here, paid his tax man extra money check into this issue a while back and the guy came back saying it could not be done. His man also said he couldn't think of WHY a company would even do it, because they make nothing off the deal.
Natch, you out there?

[dan4th]

I appreciate your reply, but may I ask where you got your information, I have several people asking me where they can find this kind of information. The reason I need to know is that Zachry is taking taxes out of per diem on the job here and unless I can find a verifiable resource (Govt.) that will disprove their claim, I have no recourse to fight them.

[HeadRat]

Search on HR Block or email them. I know because a buddy of mine (NATCH on here) paid his tax man extra to look into this issue a year or two ago. His Tax Man came back to him telling him that Per Diem is untouchable. I'll get you another link to check on it with in one second.

[HeadRat]

Try this and tell them I sent you from this site.

http://www.kiwitax.com/contact.htm

[dan4th]

Head Rat, thanks for the info. I sent them a message and am waiting for a reply and will post what I find out.

[HeadRat]

yeah, please let me know, they are one of the Online Tax Services I have invited to the site to help us all out.

[Natch]

I'm not sure what these companies are trying to pull, but as far as I know, per diem and M&IE are non taxable.
I was starting to get jumpy hearing about all this expense taxing shit a couple of years ago, so I had my accountant do a search and check to make sure that I wasn't going to get pounded by the IRS for not paying a cent on expenses for over 18 years. I didn't want to get caught with my pants down and have to pay up, so I paid him extra to check this out for me.
His reply was that per diem and M&IE are 'expenses' and not income, therefor not taxable.
He said that the company may ask for receipts or make you fill out forms showing where the money went, just to cover their butts when the IRS comes visiting and wants to know where all that money went.
As for the one year limit on whether or not it's taxable, I spent two years in Cuba and two years in Rome and never had to pay a dime in taxes.
The only way I can see that this money is taxable is if the laws have changed in the last year or so, since I checked this out.
I've been using this accountant for over 25 years. He knows his shit and I trust him completely. If any of you rats would like to talk to my accountant, I can give you his contact info.
My question for you guys is this. If you have to pay taxes on M&IE, are you goin to be expected to pay taxes on the money that the company is paying for your living quarters? Is there a difference in these expenses?
I smell a rat and he's not part of the pack.

[TheJester]

There must be some way that the company benefits from trying to pull this crap because otherwise they wouldn't even try it.
We had a guy on our job here that they were taxing, I told him they couldn't so he challenged it, and they told him that it was an accounting error, he would get the money back. Tuesday I'll have to check and see if they ever rectified it, but personally, I think they are just trying to do it and see if they can get away with it.

This is another example of us all sticking together because once they do it enough, they will reguard it as policy, no matter if it is right or wrong. :nono:

[dan4th]

If Per Diem is going to be taxed ( included in your wages )depends on several issues:
If your company has an accountable or nonaccountable plan concerning expense reimbursements.
If the job assignment you are on is considered to be temporary or if it expected to last longer than one year.
If your company gives you a daily fixed amount of per diem, not greater than the listed government amount, and does not require you to turn in expense reports, the amount of per diem is not subject to withholding tax and is not included in your wages. If they are giving you an amount greater than the listed government amount, the amount above the listed amount is included as wages and subject to withholding taxes.

If you take a job assignment that initially is expected to last more than one year, or at some point in time it becomes an expectation the assignment will exceed one year in duration, they are required to include any per diem in wages and withhold the required taxes.

If you receive per diem that does not cover all your expenses you deduct these expenses from your income on Schedule A, Itemized Deductions. These deductions are reduced by 2 1/2 percent of your adjusted gross income. You may also qualify in addition to excluding up to $80,000 of your foreign income living expenses incurred on your assignment. You can find more information on deducting travel expenses on my web site, www.kiwitax.com.

I hope this has help you, but if you have specific questions do not hesitate to contact me.

James Newton

[Bontom]

I'm not sure how many people we are talking about here, but a company pays taxes quarterly. Every dime they can keep in their accounts is making interest. That just a thought. As we have seen in the last few years, companies pretty much do what ever they want. Let stick together on this one.
Bontom :2cents

[HeadRat]

If your company gives you a daily fixed amount of per diem, not greater than the listed government amount, and does not require you to turn in expense reports, the amount of per diem is not subject to withholding tax and is not included in your wages. Thanks Dan4th, I just got the same thing back and wanted to make sure this was pointed out. Most companies DO NOT pay full per diem, so you can can not be taxed on your per diem.

Also, I had heard a couple months ago that the government is considering going after a company or some companies because they were not paying out the full per diem, yet they were getting paid for it. Anyone hear anything else?

[SK 38 wireman]

Fluor/jones are taxing the per for all the guys that singed duration of job contracts.And since the job was supposed to last more than one year they are not budging.They told all of us that since they do so much work for the government , the govt. really watches them.
I am here in Tbilisi, and since I am here I really dont know what my recourse is.I dont want to quit this job since Fluor has a ton of work,and probably wont get hired again.
There is no way you can get everyone to stop working,or quit since alot of guys are getting transferred here and it doesn't affect them.
Now What?

[TheJester]

First, go to the main page, in the links section there is a Per Diem Rate link. Look up you current rate for Tblisi, Georga. Then see if that matches what you are getting.

If you are getting less than FULL PER DIEM, you can NOT be taxed. You can then go to whoever you go to, and point out that you are not getting full per diem, you checked with a tax man, and that is wrong. You should be getting full per diem or more to be taxed, man.

You're getting it in the pooper if they are taxing your per diem.

The companies are being watched because they are being investigated as to why companies are charging the government for full per diem, but only paying out some of it. They are also getting investigated as to why they are charging higher rates of pay and paying less. The majority of companies are in for some deep shit as they are basically pulling the same thing Halliburton got busted for in Iraq. Over charging the government.

Companies are NOT taxed on the money given to them from the government for Per Diem purposes, and then taxing you, that is like trying to sell tools and material after a job that they did not pay tariffs to get into the country. It is illegal.

Ever why Jones/Fluor is the ONLY company trying to pull this? Well, I heard Zachry is trying the same thing to. I suggest pointing out this post and source from Kiwi Tax Services. Hell, print it off, it is WRONG MISTER.

[Natch]

My accountant says that you got it right Dan.
It all boils down to this......if you plan to stay on the same project for more than one year, or if you sign a contract that is projected to keep you on one site more than one year, you are liable for the appropriate taxes and your company is 'supposed' to deduct this from your deposit.
If it turns out that you remain on that one project 'less' than one year, you can file and get the amount deducted returned to you.
This is the kind of shit that ya get when they 'cut' taxes. They just find ways to make up the difference somewhere else. :kib:
By the way, HeadRat, this link will take you directly to the international per diem rates.
https://secureapp2.hqda.pentagon.mil/perdiem/ovs05-03.txt